In some quarters, this engagement with aesthetic matters in the Black Arts movement was treated as a new (or even a surprising) development. However, as Stuart explains in the interview in chapter 9 of the succeeding volume, in many ways this simply took him back to his early interest in documentary photography. 57 Moreover, as made clear in an interview with Colin MacCabe in 2007, so far as he was concerned, he had been involved in arguments about aesthetics for almost fifty years, ever since writing The Popular Arts with Paddy Whannel. His aesthetic position was always premised on the notion that deconstructing the claims of high art to monopolize aesthetic value does not in any way involve uncritically celebrating all aspects of popular art. For Stuart, the argument about any particular cultural form still has to be evaluative, and the value of any particular manifestation of popular art has to be established by close critical attention. As he scathingly remarks, the kind of “flat populism” that came to prevail in some sections of Cultural Studies (as in the critiques made by Simon Frith and Jon Savage) is no use at all in this endeavor. For him, it remained crucial to be able to make distinctions of value that would enable us to identify (in the example he chooses) precisely why Billie Holiday is far better than other popular singers: because, he explains, her voice can be argued to find a form of expression for a complex range of feelings and experiences toward which others can only gesture. While he is concerned to destabilize the uncritical canonization of the established hierarchies of fine art and to argue for the potential value of the popular, the fine-grained process of evaluation of what exactly it is about one piece of art that makes it better than another remains crucial. As he explains it, what he is interested in is “the decanonization of the (established) categories” alongside the “retention of the critical function.” As always with Stuart, that is a Big Ask. But equally, to return to my earlier comments on his interest in—and commitment to—opening up, rather than closing down, debates, this is also a creative reposing of the questions at stake. 58